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Note: This discussion is about an older version of the COMSOL Multiphysics® software. The information provided may be out of date.

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can comsol support multilayer shell?

Posted May 3, 2012, 3:31 a.m. EDT MEMS & Nanotechnology, MEMS & Piezoelectric Devices, Geometry, Materials, Mesh, Modeling Tools & Definitions, Parameters, Variables, & Functions, Studies & Solvers, Structural Mechanics Version 4.0, Version 4.0a, Version 4.1, Version 4.2, Version 4.2a 6 Replies

Borshiun Lee
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Dear all,

I am trying to model a membrane using shell element because thickness is quite thin compared to length and width. But the membrane is lamated with three to five different materials and thickness at different location. It seems impossible to use 3D solid model that will lead too many mesh elements. Do anyone know how to do multilayer shell in comsol?
6 Replies Last Post Jul 24, 2012, 1:06 a.m. EDT
Ivar KJELBERG COMSOL Multiphysics(r) fan, retired, former "Senior Expert" at CSEM SA (CH)
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Posted: 1 decade ago May 3, 2012, 6:02 a.m. EDT
Hi

have you checked the 3D "thin film" BC properties, some can cope with multiple layers (check carefully the doc and test it out as not all properties mightbe fully developped in such cases.

I cannot really say anything about stacked shell, never tried ;)

--
Good luck
Ivar
Hi have you checked the 3D "thin film" BC properties, some can cope with multiple layers (check carefully the doc and test it out as not all properties mightbe fully developped in such cases. I cannot really say anything about stacked shell, never tried ;) -- Good luck Ivar
Nagi Elabbasi Facebook Reality Labs
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Posted: 1 decade ago May 3, 2012, 8:48 a.m. EDT
I believe COMSOL does not support multi-layered shells
I believe COMSOL does not support multi-layered shells
Borshiun Lee
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Posted: 1 decade ago May 3, 2012, 9:23 p.m. EDT
I think this kind of structure is very common in MEMS.
How a pity that Comsol can not do this.
Do anyone know other possible skills to deal wih this?
I think this kind of structure is very common in MEMS. How a pity that Comsol can not do this. Do anyone know other possible skills to deal wih this?
Ivar KJELBERG COMSOL Multiphysics(r) fan, retired, former "Senior Expert" at CSEM SA (CH)
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Posted: 1 decade ago May 4, 2012, 2:04 a.m. EDT
Hi

perhaps, if we are enough to ask "support" it might appear in one of the future versions. The COMSOL developpers are rather reactive and helpfull in this way.

And I agree structural FEM in COMSOL, for engineers, lacks many of the "ususal" features from other well established FEM programmes . Probably mechanics is not "sexy" enough ;)

But COMSOL remains the only one you can link in the other physics in a "natural/usual" way

--
Good luck
Ivar
Hi perhaps, if we are enough to ask "support" it might appear in one of the future versions. The COMSOL developpers are rather reactive and helpfull in this way. And I agree structural FEM in COMSOL, for engineers, lacks many of the "ususal" features from other well established FEM programmes . Probably mechanics is not "sexy" enough ;) But COMSOL remains the only one you can link in the other physics in a "natural/usual" way -- Good luck Ivar
Nagi Elabbasi Facebook Reality Labs
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Posted: 1 decade ago May 4, 2012, 10:05 a.m. EDT
If your concern when using 3D solid elements is the large number of elements resulting from the high aspect then you should try meshing one 2D face of the membrane and doing mesh Sweep. That way you control the mesh size in the plane and in the thickness directions independently.

Nagi Elabbasi
Veryst Engineering
If your concern when using 3D solid elements is the large number of elements resulting from the high aspect then you should try meshing one 2D face of the membrane and doing mesh Sweep. That way you control the mesh size in the plane and in the thickness directions independently. Nagi Elabbasi Veryst Engineering
Ajay Dangi
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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 24, 2012, 1:06 a.m. EDT
Hi,
In my opinion need of laminated shell support is definitely there. Most of MEMS devices have these weird aspect ratio where using 3-D requires too many elements. Its pretty hard to handle. Sweeping a meshed surface is not possible in all cases & also results that way don't seems very reliable. I am trying to see if bucking of thin membranes (one layer as well as multilayer) due to compressive residual stress is possible to analyze but comsol isn't giving any buckling mode, even after giving small eccentric load. Can you advise me in this situation?
Thanks,
E-Mail: dangi.ajay@gmail.com
Hi, In my opinion need of laminated shell support is definitely there. Most of MEMS devices have these weird aspect ratio where using 3-D requires too many elements. Its pretty hard to handle. Sweeping a meshed surface is not possible in all cases & also results that way don't seems very reliable. I am trying to see if bucking of thin membranes (one layer as well as multilayer) due to compressive residual stress is possible to analyze but comsol isn't giving any buckling mode, even after giving small eccentric load. Can you advise me in this situation? Thanks, E-Mail: dangi.ajay@gmail.com

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